Jump to content
  • Announcements

    • Brad Eden

      TO THOSE REGISTERING FOR MEMBERSHIP ON UJ   01/06/2018

      To the Guests who have decided to register for Membership. PLEASE read Terms of Service, not just checking it off. This is covered there: Add more info than just "hunting" or "Upland hunting" or "birds" or "outdoors" or similar nebulous terms in the required INTERESTS field. Despite this Boards strong spam filtering function, some Spam registrations do sneak through. I need an inkling that you are a human being not a Spam Bot tagging onto key words. Also please do not use a business name as your User Name. Thank you.
Sign in to follow this  
CptSydor

Keeping on weight

Recommended Posts

CptSydor

I have a 2 year old Brittany. Over the summer, he put on a little weight, to the point where I could feel his ribs with a little pressure, but you could tell he had a little layer of fat on him. During hunting season that went away. Now that winter is here, he's coming on lots of winter adventures (mainly back country skiing) and he's spending 1-2 (or more) hours a day running through waist to neck deep snow, up and down the side of a mountain in sub freezing temperatures.

 

 We've been giving him lots of food. As reference, during summer, to maintain, he was at 1.5 cups per day. During hunting season he was up to 2-2.5. Not he's often at 3.5+ and still loosing weight. It's not unexpected however, the effort he's putting out currently it very calorie demanding (happens to me as well when I'm doing high intensity winter activities).

 

 He's always had relatively loose stools and been on higher fat/protein diets. This summer we traveled a lot and moved cross country, his food changed due to availability. He also went through a couple bouts of diarrhea this summer where he was perfectly healthy/normal. Vet suggested he was sensitive to the higher fat/protein foods and suggested moving him to more regular food. I don't think the food was the complete solution, but his stool is consistently really good now.

 

 But I want him to stop loosing weight. He's getting to be a bag of bones. It almost feels like I could feed him endlessly with his current food and it wouldn't help and he'll be continuing on the adventures.

 

Any suggestions of stuff I could add to his food to help him out? Stuff that will keep his stools firm? Should I just keep adding more food? Or switch back to a higher fat/protein food?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
VizslavsBird
 
This is an old show dog trick called Satin Balls.  Be careful, you can put weight on a dog fast.
 
Don't mix or hide Satin Balls in with kibble, your dog will make a mess of the kibble, trying to get to the Satin Balls. Its ok to freeze Satin Balls in pre-formed and weighed portions.
When mixing the ingredients, it is a gooey mass. For easy clean up purposes, I wear Latex Exam Gloves and mix by hand.
 
All ingredients are uncooked RAW and "Satin Balls" are served raw.
 
1 lb cheap hamburger (for high fat %)
1 and 1/3 cups Total cereal
1 and 1/2 cups uncooked oatmeal
1 raw egg
6 Tablespoons wheat germ
1 package Knox unflavored gelatin
2 Tablespoons vegetable oil
2 Tablespoons unsulfured molasses
Pinch of salt
Roll into a ball about the size of a golf ball.
 
One ball a day to start, then maybe go up to two balls a day

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
E.Young

We have experienced something similar - our female setter really thinned out during the season. She'd been eating around 2 cups of PPP Savor, but now she's up to 3-4c/day of PPP Performance and while she gained a little back, she was still quite thin. 

 

We started giving her "Ultra Mega High Calorie Booster" which we found at the local specialty store, along with some canned pumpkin for fiber, and she's lookin' good now. Still thin, lean and mean, but without the hip bones poking up.

 

We also have the added joy/complication of having a puppy who would do anything for food - anything - and he'd eat himself to death if we let him. Yet our older female is a dainty, casual diner, content to eat a meal over the course of five minutes while our pup would eat the same thrice over in half the time if we'd let him. We started separating them when we left the house and letting the female free feed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DocE

I would suggest coconut oil.

.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Harry

You could give him a break. Exercise is good, too much isn't and when you are eating for bulk and not getting there it may be time for time off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Remo

Might want to run a stool sample into the vet for a check too. My dogs eat the damnedest things that come back to haunt them. Uck.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ray Gubernat

The simple answer to keeping weight on a hard working dog is...FAT. 

 

A canine can absolutely thrive on a diet that is up to 50% fat.   Moreover, if the dog's diet is high in fat and it gets used to that diet while doing strenuous exercise, the dog's metabolism will shift to a fat metabolizing  mode.

 

Humans use sugar for energy.  When they run out of sugar in the bloodstream, they hit a wall.  Dogs also use sugar in the bloodstream, but when there is fat available, and their system is conditioned to it, they can apparently  metabolize it much better than humans and use it to provide working energy. 

 

You can use oil added to your dog's kibble, but as you may suspect, this can lead to loose stools.   I suggest raw beef fat, chopped fairly fine, or ground as an additive to your dog's kibble. 

 

When I was doing a lot of hunting with just one or two dogs, I would visit the supermarket when there was a beef sale and ask the butchers for beef fat.  Typically they would give it to me or charge me a nominal( like ten cents per pound) fee.  I would chop it up, put it in 1/4# baggies and freeze it. 

 

I rarely had to use more than one baggie per dog per feeding to keep their weight on, and these were dogs that ran hard for four to six hours a day, five days a week. 

 

Oh and one other thing...I found that wetting the kibble down with some warm water increased the likelihood that the dog, although bone tired, would still be enticed to eat it s food and it also made the kibble more easily digestible.  So the dog ate its whole portion and got the max out of it.

 

Wetting down the kibble was an invaluable strategy when taking the dog on a multiple day hunting trip.  It kept the dog from developing bloody stools from passing partially digested kibble which can tend to be hard and gritty,  through its colon, whose int4erior is quite sensitive  and easily scratched. 

 

RayG

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Chukarman

 As usual, Ray is spot on. Feed your dog a fat rich diet... they metabolize fat before any carbs - forget human diets, they do not apply. Feed a 20/30 kible and pour animal fat over it. Let the dog eat as much as he wants. Keep running him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dogwood

Caveat: When increasing the fat content of the diet significantly it should be done very gradually over the course of 3-4 weeks or you risk triggering a nasty case of pancreatitis. The loose stool issue discussed with your vet could have been a prelude to such a problem, so I would be ETREMELY  cautious in your dog’s case. In fact, given his history, I would simply increase the volume of his current food and be patient. By age 3-4 tops most dog’s metabolisms slow down a bit and keeping weight on becomes much easier. Kinda like when I hit 30🐖😱

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Urban_Redneck

Sounds as if your dog has reached the limit of what his body can utilize from a cereal based diet.

 

To avoid cannon butt, I would add raw meat and fat slowly, i.e. 2oz per feeding for a few days before adding more. Beef can be a little rich to start a kibble fed dog, ground chicken or turkey is probably best.

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dave Quindt
1 hour ago, Dogwood said:

. In fact, given his history, I would simply increase the volume of his current food and be patient.

 

 

I was thinking the exact same thing; 3.5 cups is not that much food for a working dog.  Another cup would increase caloric intake by nearly 25%.  I'd also think about feeding 2x day (if not doing so already) on non-working days. 

 

There are lots of other potential solutions; probiotics to improve digestion, topping current food with corn oil to increase calories, adding fiber, etc.  All have a place, but just increasing food intake is the easiest place to start.  I'd be curious about the food brand being fed.

 

JMO,

Dave

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
CptSydor

Thanks for the responses. I'm worried about just adding a bunch of fat for the reasons previously mentioned. I'll try just adding more food at this point.

 

My Britt has been 36lbs since he was 9 months old at healthy, athletic weight. Never 'filled' out. Last weight he was 34.5 partway through hunting season, but I suspect he's below 33 now. He's got his annual shots next week, so I'll get another weight and further discuss with the vet.

 

Given his size, that's why approaching 4 cups a day (twice daily feeding all his life) just seems a lot to me. He poops like a machine with that much food :)

 

 He spent most of this life on this:

 

Inukshuk

 

   Mostly the 26/16 and some 30/25 during hunting. Until he had the issues this summer i never thought much of it as there was no major problems, but in retrospect, I wouldn't say he was doing well on it. His afternoon stools were never firm.

 

 This summer he moved over to Acana after my supply of Inukshuk ran out. That's when the problems started.

 

 I'm not going to lie, his diet lately has been a blend. He moved over to Royal Canin Gastro after the second bought of bum aches. Then to just regular Royal Canin adult (advised by vet), but a friend's dog passed away and they had some Costco Kirkland stuff hanging around that I blended in. He's doing great, always firm stools, other than not keeping on the weight.

 

 He's at the point right about now where I need to make a choice as to how to progress with daily food as he's going to run out in a few weeks.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
CptSydor

Kinda forgot I had a vet appointment next week with him before posting this as well :), but appreciate all the responses.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DonT
15 hours ago, Ray Gubernat said:

The simple answer to keeping weight on a hard working dog is...FAT. 

 

A canine can absolutely thrive on a diet that is up to 50% fat.   Moreover, if the dog's diet is high in fat and it gets used to that diet while doing strenuous exercise, the dog's metabolism will shift to a fat metabolizing  mode.

 

Humans use sugar for energy.  When they run out of sugar in the bloodstream, they hit a wall.  Dogs also use sugar in the bloodstream, but when there is fat available, and their system is conditioned to it, they can apparently  metabolize it much better than humans and use it to provide working energy. 

 

 

Ray I like and agree with all of this, one smart guy here.  I feed RAW so all my dogs energy comes from fat and I adjust the amount of fat based on activity.  They do well on fat and keep their weight on, also I think it's easier on a dog to utilize fat for energy.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
bobman
22 hours ago, Harry said:

You could give him a break. Exercise is good, too much isn't and when you are eating for bulk and not getting there it may be time for time off.

 

this! at least cut back to every other day, I would give him a complete recovery week off then run him every other day

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×