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Speedgoat44

Got the 'fuzz' called on me today...

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Speedgoat44

Warning - quasi rant to follow:  

I was in an eatery enjoying some pizza with family in a semi-urban town in Colorado when a LEO came in asking who owned the two dogs that were kenneled in the vehicle in the parking lot.  I told the officer they were mine, and asked if there was a problem.  She said that she'd been called on an 'animal cruelty' complaint.  I told her I'd be happy to show her my dogs, and assured her they were comfortable and well cared-for.  Some background:  60 degrees, mostly cloudy, parked under the only tree in the parking lot for extra shade, and windows cracked two inches on both driver and passenger side.  After a lengthy conversation which included her getting into my car to informally assess the temperature, and enduring a lecture on the petmate crates the dogs were in (she said they were too small) she let me go without a citation.  She did write my name and address down.  She said that i should familiarize myself with local ordinances involving treatment of animals before packing my dogs up and travelling to those destinations.  Say what?!  She recommended I get a larger carrier for my dogs (I use the intermediate, which fits my 45lb dogs perfectly - they can turn around, they can lie down - they can even stretch out).  She also said that I should crack the windows much more, to which I asked how I should keep someone from stealing a couple of neat-lookin' bird dogs.  No answer.  I didn't get cited, so I guess all's well that ends well, but, c'mon!   Sort of a head-shaker to me, but maybe I'm missing something.  I read the ordinance involving vehicles, and it almost read like you could never keep a critter in the vehicle for any reason or any amount of time.  Any thoughts?    

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Fins and Feathers

Maybe tint your windows so nobody can see in.  

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topdog1961

Find yourself some literature, the more official the organization the better, on sizing crates to dogs. What I read many years ago explained that for centuries wild dogs lived in tiny burrows and that they still feel safest in confined spaces. There should be room to turn around and that's it. My dogs sleep in crates that size every night and love it. Every evening, often before I'm ready to put them up, all three get in their crates and give me that look. A look that says "give me my treat and pillow, I'm ready for bed."

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Brad Eden

My pet peeve, that I have ranted about here before. This story makes my blood boil. You were patient, but the temptation to lecture this LEO in sporting dog care must have been fierce. UNDERSTAND I UNDERSTAND that certainly some people are idiots with dogs and even kids in hot vehicles, but the 'do gooder on parking lot patrol' are like terrorists. My daugher won't leave her dogs in her vehicle unattended for a millisecond for fear someone will break the windows. As mentioned....before...never forget the woman with her daughter telling a clerk at Dicks about a poor dog in an old yellow jeep that was dying of heat stroke in parking lot. They were so proud, and the woman so smug teaching her daughter the right thing to do...I left and went out to look and as god is my witness there was jeep with a nice lab sitting in back seat happy as a clam, with the windows so low he could have jumped out if he so pleased. DU sticker etc. Boils my blood thinking what this poor guy had to deal with after I left. Rant over.

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hayslope

I know that feeling Brad.  Just don't get me started.

 

Although, at a local strip mall, I once had the pleasure to overhear a local LEO dress a crazy "animal lover" up one side and down the other, for reporting a guy for leaving his big goofy lab in his car in the summer......get this.....with the car running and air conditioning on.  The officer asked her multiple times if she noticed the engine running.  She didn't know how to respond.  The owner "thanked" the woman (kind of sarcastically) for her concern and then suggested that she spend her time more productively running traffic control on the local squirrels to avoid so many getting squished on the streets! 

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Irishwhistler
1 hour ago, topdog1961 said:

Find yourself some literature, the more official the organization the better, on sizing crates to dogs. What I read many years ago explained that for centuries wild dogs lived in tiny burrows and that they still feel safest in confined spaces. There should be room to turn around and that's it. My dogs sleep in crates that size every night and love it. Every evening, often before I'm ready to put them up, all three get in their crates and give me that look. A look that says "give me my treat and pillow, I'm ready for bed."

 

Aye Mates,

I was an LEO for most o' me career and can affirmatively say that the professions is far from exempt o' idiots so employed.  The cop in this example was either a fascist with regard to how the statute / regulation gets applied, a PETA sympathizer, or an idiot with zero common sense and zero use of discretion.  As a first line supervisor of many years I stressed the use of common sense discretion in the application of laws and regulations to all o' the officers that worked for me and the far majority were excellent in doing so.  I did have one "problem child" that found his way into the hot seat in me office more than once for a full blown Irish ass chewing that eventually evolved into an IA and administrative actions taken against him.  Sometimes ye just can't fix the void betwixt the ears.

 

As for the specific situation in this thread, it seems to me that the officer had plenty o' room to exercise discretion and to realize that it was a BS complaint.

 

I personally was working at a large antique show here in New England and had TRAD comfortably crated, at rest, with supplied and accessible water, under a shaded canopy.  Some woman came up complaining that the dog was being "tortured" and asked one o' me mates whom the owner was.  He pointed to me and sat down with a bag o' popcorn to watch the anticipated fireworks.  I told the woman I owned the dog.  She said, "you are torturing that dog".  I asked her just how she had reached that conclusion and she said "I train dogs and that crate is to small".  I replied,  "I too train dogs and the crate is actually a bit too large for optimal safety in vehicular transport".  I then followed with, " if you really thing I am torturing this dog that gets treated better than most humans, please call the police right now and we will get the matter resolved, I'll even let ye use me phone to make the call".  She stood there staring at me as if waiting for me to say something else.  I obliged her with "Lady - GO AWAY".  She then told me "you are going to hell".  I replied, "that's betwixt me and God , but if I do, I am certain I'll see ye there".  LMIAO.

 

Ye just can't fix stupid.

 

Cheers,

THE DOG WHISTLER

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Larry Brown

Didn't result in the cops being called, but I did find a note under my wiper once.  I was hunting quail down in southern AZ.  Wife and I took a day off, went up to Tucson and visited the Arizona Sonora Desert Museum.  (Great place to visit if you're down that way.)  Pickup with a topper, double aluminum crate under the topper.  Temp was probably mid-60's.  Because I can padlock the crate, I usually leave the rear topper window open when I park and it's warm.  Side topper windows were also open.  Dogs had water.  Anyone bothering to put their hand on the aluminum crate would have found that it wasn't even warm to the touch.  And the dogs were snoozing.  Yet the note informed me how I was mistreating my dogs.

 

That same stop involved another interesting incident.  We're in the aviary, and the wife and I were watching a pair of Mearns quail (which I'd been hunting) doing what Mearns do:  digging like crazy.  An elderly couple wandered by.  Wife asked husband what kind of birds they were, and why they were digging.  He didn't know, so she asked me.  I explained that they were Mearns quail that eat roots and such, and dig for their food.  About that time, some little wren flitted by.  She asked me if I knew what kind of bird that was.  Told her I only knew it was something I couldn't shoot.  She left in a huff.

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TonyS

These fanatics with their 'protection' drive me nuts.  I have, after incidents such as being in a covered parking structure with some woman screaming she was calling the police on my mistreatment of my dog in the cab of my pickup with the windows down.  I invited her to call right now.  And be sure to state her name and address when the police arrive.  Oh and expect an invitation to court for harassment.  She left in a huff.

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shinbone

Not sure what it is like in other states, but in Colorado, watch out!  Colorado just passed a law making it legal for a person to bust out a window in your car if they think your dog is in distress.

 

https://milehighvet.com/2017/08/colorados-new-dog-in-car-law/

 

And, note that the dog doesn't have to actually be in danger, just that the person busting out your window only needs a reasonable belief that it was, to be protected from liability.   You get one wack-job-do-gooder (and there are lot of those around) coupled with a LEO unfamiliar with dog care, and you can be in a world of hurt.

 

Wack-job-do-gooders tend to concentrate in big cities, and, living in Denver, I remove all valuables from my car during warm weather, and make sure the windows are cranked wide open and doors unlocked whenever I park with the mutts in the vehicle.  I want it to be absolutely clear that anyone and everyone can freely access the interior of my vehicle simply by opening a door, to mitigate anyone busting out a window.

 

Totally stupid BS, but that is the law in Colorado.  It is sad what is happening to this State.

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Brad Eden

I think we can all agree, that as as I said. There are instances when dogs (and children) are in real danger and action should be taken. Determining that is the rub. Many dogs that may be fine for the 5 minutes it's in a vehicle with cracked windows, are gonna look deeply disturbed and stressed with strangers staring at it and fooling with the doors and windows! 

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Millriver

Let me weigh in from the other perspective. My daughter, who I am very proud of, works as an LEO in town where we have, for lack of a better word, a large tourist attraction that draws thousands of visitors every year. Last Sunday, when the temperatures hit 90 degrees, she was seconds from smashing a window of a closed vehicle with a dog inside when the owner came out. His explanation was he left the car running while inside, but it shuts off after 15 minutes, and he lost track of time while inside for 30 minutes! A stern finger waving later, all went on their way.

 

I guess the point is not everyone the police encounter is as caring as those of us with bird dogs, and they frequently have to make decisions that aren't always agreeable to some. That being said, some police officers are more knowledgeable and reasonable than others, my daughter being one of them.

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Mike Connally
49 minutes ago, shinbone said:

Not sure what it is like in other states, but in Colorado, watch out!  Colorado just passed a law making it legal for a person to bust out a window in your car if they think your dog is in distress.

 

https://milehighvet.com/2017/08/colorados-new-dog-in-car-law/

 

And, note that the dog doesn't have to actually be in danger, just that the person busting out your window had reasonable belief that it was.   You get one wack-job-do-gooder (and there are lot of those around) coupled with a LEO unfamiliar with dog care, and you can be in a world of hurt.

 

In warm weather, I remove all valuables from my car, and make sure the windows are cranked wide open and doors unlocked whenever I park with the mutts in the vehicle.  I want it to be absolutely clear that anyone and everyone can freely access the interior of my vehicle simply by opening a door, to mitigate anyone busting out a window.

 

Totally stupid BS, but that is the law in Colorado.  It is sad what is happening to this State.

It sounds like Colorado is fast becoming Western California. 

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co_setter
2 minutes ago, Mike Connally said:

It sounds like Colorado is fast becoming Western California. 

Although I would argue the direction - yes, we have been Californicated.

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shinbone
7 hours ago, co_setter said:

. . .  yes, we have been Californicated.

 

So true!  And it will only continue to get worse for the foreseeable future.

 

LEO's have always been able to bust out a window where warranted in the enforcement of animal cruelty laws.  I have no problem with that because even if they aren't a dog person, they are at least a professional and know they can't kick-in a window without real justification.

 

What I don't like about the Colorado law is that it protects people who have no qualifications to judge the condition of a dog and who many times have skewed judgement, to cause unjustified property damage with no consequences and practically no oversight.  Now, joe- or jane-citizen can smash a window because the dog was in a crate and they don't like dog crates, or they think the crate was too small, or the dog had on an e-collar, or there was hunter-orange clothing inside, or the vehicle had an NRA sticker on it, etc.  As long as it is a warm day and they state "I thought I saw the dog panting in there", they will likely get away with it, too.

 

The only effective defense I can see is to have your windows wide open and the vehicle unlocked, which means you can't leave your valuables in there.

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terrym

I leave my crate on the back seat of my truck all season. I was having lunch one day in one of the travel/rest areas we have up here and some busybody spotted it. She went around trying to get somebody to smash my window in. Some guy told me what was going on and I went out to shut her down. The crate was empty and I am perfectly capable of caring for my dogs but I came close to having a nutcase smash my windows. 

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