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Possumtown

Bummed out, bad news

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Virgil Kane
18 minutes ago, bigjohnsd said:

And yet with a birth rate less than yhe death rate without immigrants the economy will collapse. This country was founded by immigrants, made by immigrants and immigrants will be the salvation of the country.  I've ridden my motorcycle back and forth across the country multiple times over the past 6 years. There is plenty of room for more people.  Change has always been frightening.  

 

Immigrants have changed also, use to be they came here to better themselves, put down roots and raise a family free from tyranny and worked their fingers to the bone.  Coming from a sanctuary state and living close to a huge sanctuary city I know that things have changed dramatically .  A smart guy here on the UJ once said " they try to change things here from which they fled" is what's happening in my area.

You are right though that there's plenty of room left (if you can afford to pull up stakes and leave what your forefathers had built behind) and change is always frightening.  Times are changing faster than ever and there's no way of slowing it down.  Nobody's got that answer.

 

Virgil

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406dn
1 hour ago, WyomingArt said:

Population of USA in 1942   135 million.  (year I was born.)

Population of USA in 2018   329 million.

 

Not much more to say, except sadly my grandchildren will never see or do what we experienced. 

 

 

This is the long and short of it. I won't look up the world population growth for the same period, but its is surely even more dramatic. The loss of open spaces is going to accelerate. Those who never had it, won't really know they are missing anything. Count your blessings that you did get to experience at least some measure of it.

 

There was a time when there was public discussion about the population of people on the earth etc. I can't remember that last time it was on the radar. It has been replaced by climate change, immigrant migrations, plastics floating in the oceans etc. When in reality, they all flow from the fact that there are too many of us at one time walking around on this planet. 

 

The cake is pretty well baked.

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spinfly

No offense taken and no apology necessary.  We all have to live somewhere, and I understand your concerns and frustration too. I grew up in a rural town here in WNY, now live in a suburban area which still has roots in farming and residential .

 

The family I bought from moved to Maryville almost 15 years ago, and my sisters best friend & husband moved to Maryville also about 10 years ago. Better climate, lower taxes, more house for your money, etc. Without getting political (which isn't allowed), the climate has changed so much from what NY was to what it has become is not in alignment with the needs and beliefs of my family. (Just watch/read the news about NY) Only thing holding us back are elderly parents which won't/can't move. It's too bad, I love the Finger Lakes, 1000 Islands and Adirondacks., but times are changing......and I need to look out for my family.

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Big Al

I don't think it's as dire as it may appear.  Still lots of open space in this great country of ours.  When we moved to Florida from Michigan in 1981 the FL population was approx 7,000,000.  It's now 20,000,000 plus and it still has plenty of forests, pastures, groves and general open spaces.   

Michigan on the other hand was about 7,000,000 when we left and has only grown to a little less than 10,000,000.  It is still the tenth largest state by population though.  Lots of open space there.

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mccuha

If you visit you’re just a yankee.  The staying part turns you into a damn yankee😂😂😂

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pa'tridge hunters

When we moved to Maine over thirty years ago the locals had the same complaint about people from away buying up all the land. 

My answer then and now is if you don't want people moving in, don't be in such a big hurry to sell your land.

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mccuha

To tell you the truth.  I have thought one day about selling or turning our land into a subdivision make a bunch of money and get the h#ll out and find somewhere closer to where I like to hunt and wouldn’t mind living due to little to no population    

This will as well get me away from the growing crowds in sc.

 I can’t understand why anyone would come here. We have no upland birds nor ducks.  

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oak stob

I don't believe the issue yet is the decline of "open" space, lot of that remains out and about....the issue appears to be one of the changing use of developed space around us.

 

35 years ago I bought a farm, the use for that land changed.

10 years or so ago, the neighboring farm sold and, at one time, there were plans for 125 houses....that grandiose and rather silly plan, based upon the area economy, fell thru but 6 were built.

6...changed the area.

So did habitat succession and deer hunting.

 

Change is often uncomfortable...always has been.

Sometimes, Progress makes up for change, it is simply that we individually fail to live long enough to realize it.

So, we are left to fume, especially if we live in areas which have witnessed development over the decades.

 

 

 

 

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john mcg

THese sorts of things are mentioned now and then...

The combined acreage of TX, MO, KS and OR is approximately 327 million acres.

 

About an acre per person--not family.

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Brad Eden

We all take "ownership" of land we don't own but are priviliged to create memories on. It stings like hell when that is gone, but the reality is if you don't own it...well you don't own it. Harsh, but true. That is a truth I have grudgingly accepted. I use to be sick to my stomach when I saw a house going in where I hunted or fresh No Hunting signs tacked up by a new land owner. At 60, living in the northeast  I've lost more bird covers and deer acreage than one can imagine. Even in rural Maine I see the erosion of accessible land, it's just a lot slower than other parts of the country. But given the legal access to unposted private property up here, (I have never been financially successful enough to buy any large tracts of land.) I've lived in a hunters paradise for over 30 years, and will continue to do so as long as I can drag myself out the door. The harsh conditions and poor working prospects up here, as SH eluded to, keeps development at a low simmer. 

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john mcg

Things are only dire if we continue the way we are going. Killing each other, polluting on a mass scale and doing an almost insane job of maximising and allocating resources. Humans are capable of doing magnificent things and solving difficult problems.

Its greed, foolishness and short sightedness that prevents it.

This world could be a paradise with nobody wanting.

It wouldn't even be difficult.

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1971snipe

I feel all of y'all's pain.  I hate quoting (sort of) Bill Clinton, but it's the truth.  Developers seemingly can't be stopped.  And times change, and rarely for the better.  Many places of my outdoors past exist in my memories now, and photos if I have them.   

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jeff88
1 hour ago, Possumtown said:

I'm not sure I agree here. This country was founded by revolutionary secessionist in the colonies, made by pioneers and sustained by them. The immigrants came later after the heavy lifting was done. 

Then I'm all mixed up:  One grandmother was 7th generation farmer in W PA, that is well before the Revolutionary War.  The other Grandmother was 1st generation German.  Both Grandfather's were 2nd generation Irishmen.  

 

I'd like to be there in the afterlife when someone tells one of my Grandads they did no "heavy Lifting", or scores of my PGH forefathers from E Europe, Italy and Ireland who worked the steel mills and dug coal how easy they had it.  There will always be heavy lifting in this country in order to keep it free and prosperous.  And unless you are a Native American, you are an immigrant.  

 

 

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bobman

The real problem is immigration without the desire to assimilate into the American culture America doesn’t have a nationality and never did.

 

immigration was stopped from the 1920s until the late 50s to allow the last wave of immigrants to assimilate 

 

current interests encourage balkinization to be to be able to pit one group against the other and that’s going to lead to very bad things for everyone 

 

new immigrants must be assimilated to become successful in our great country 

 

And lastly immigration goals should be for our country’s citizens benefit not for the immigrant 

 

 

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MAArcher
25 minutes ago, Big Al said:

I don't think it's as dire as it may appear.  Still lots of open space in this great country of ours.  When we moved to Florida from Michigan in 1981 the FL population was approx 7,000,000.  It's now 20,000,000 plus and it still has plenty of forests, pastures, groves and general open spaces.   

Michigan on the other hand was about 7,000,000 when we left and has only grown to a little less than 10,000,000.  It is still the tenth largest state by population though.  Lots of open space there.

It is actually a lot more dire than it appears.  Take a look at this picture of the US at night from space:

682780107_USatnight.jpg.401b13d6c1eb131444cc37a9d005f163.jpg

 

See all the lights in the eastern half, that's about three and quarter million people's worth of light.  The US population is set to double in less than 100 years.  How many lights do you think we'll see in the west when we reach six hundred and fifty thousand by the time kids born today reach 80?  

 

Unless of course we have different definitions of "dire".  To me "dire" is no natural ecosystems left (some scientist argue that there already aren't, humans significantly influence them all).  We're already loosing species at a rate of 24-150 a day or 10% of all species each decade.   How many children already grow up without ever walking on unpaved ground except for a small patch of featureless city playground?  People outside urban areas can't comprehend the significance of that.  30 years ago I brought friends from my new job in Boston, MA to visit my family home in southern Maine.  A man and a woman, both in their 20's.  And towards the end of that ride, two hours from where they had grown up, they for the first time saw live cows.  Can you imagine that?  Who's going to vote to preserve open space when they don't really comprehend what's at risk?  If they've never even seen wild for themselves?  Now imagine that the next three hundred million people added to our population are immigrants, without generations of family ties to the land.  That equates to open space in the US having a snowballs chance in hell of being preserved.  To me that's "dire".  

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